how to make money from home (online marketing strategy)

All right I think we’re like what’s going on. It’s her route here. And today we’re back with another expert. I’ve got a really awesome guest somebody who has done some really really cool stuff when it comes to not only writing not only at marketing and hopefully manage that but like working with some big names in this industry and really kind of your topper again right now of course you can only keep going out. So you have a baseline and you’re going out but it’s super exciting. Have you on. I want to hear not so humble kind of a headline story. Who you are and you heard that breakdown so that they are sure Manuel did. It’s awesome to be on here with you guys. He planned a fan of the platform connect with the recently and just you know falling got a funny guy. It’s just awesome to see this tool answering a lot of questions that like I’ve been
trying to solve for years with like 50 different tools and analytics like this. So first off thank you for that but out of my 10 seconds. Hi hyperreal if you know I I work with a lot of Internet markers. You know I started with the old syndicate gaming back in the day Frank Kern and JENKINS All those guys kind of happened into it you know it was one of those things I ran an agency
building Web sites and just so happened my brand had captured the attention of a lot of
these guys and they’re like we need some of that
whatever you’re doing we can use that. So over the last few years the business
just keeps evolving changing it’s just not every six months it seems like the model changed a bit. But recently the main focus has been using this marking skills the final skills of copyright and all that and really kind of shift in how I sell it. So as opposed to what is new which is like retainer is actually like selling the funnels to sell people’s products. Now it’s more of a partnership type deal
so it’s not like a foreign concept to most
people like equity consulting like the idea of
getting in on a percentage of sales. But my big thing is is building a network between my clients so two of my bigger clients people might know is time Lopez and Sam oven’s Tai Lopez runs knowledge societies got a lot of products from as Lamborghini’s fold and it’s hard to miss it if you’re on
YouTube. But you know taking him as a client. You know I went to him
because I was just curious about what he was
doing. So I wanted to get involved and learn from him. So it talked about that I got some funnel ideas together all that. But then it evolved into. All right well let’s hope you promote
other people so that kept growing evolving. Then I found another guy Sam oven’s who
has an awesome product. Honestly to be fully transparent I was
super jealous because I was like This is the
product I want to make right. Like it. So instead of going out and making that product they actually decided to partner with them early on and help and promote it. So when Al found him affiliate’s and then just kind of built this network
where I would build the deal along with the funnel. So it wasn’t just funnel
development copyright that it was actually designing
the promotion and connecting those people so probably familiar with the concept toJ.V.
brokering which is just joint venture deals. This is a little bit different in the
sense that I’m actually building everything out too. So it’s kind of putting those two worlds together and it really helped transform my business as a solo maneuver and few sources and things but I still don’t have like a staff in a team that I it’s not really like what I want in my business so I’ve been able to do about 40 million in revenue between my clients over the last few years just using that model and leveraging their audiences and awesome products and the funnels in between. So that’s that’s in a nutshell what I do. And it’s you know at the heart I’m still like an agency like
you still build stuff I still love doing copy and it’s my main focus. But I found it a much more profitable business model to actually get equity in the promotion as long as the
deal is right. Yeah that’s amazing. Everyone who’s watching us if you’re
watching live say you’re watching live if you’re watching the replay but have said what it was like. How’s it going. Everyone I hope you guys like attention you heard the broker over your clients generate all us years and your workplace. First of all I like how nonchalantly said back say you know we’re the. JENKINS Right. So you know I’m also working with Sam Obinze I will. OK. I’ve got a lot of questions for trying to figure out where I want to take this on the. It’s like. Let let’s start with how you can start these relationships because that in itself is a pretty Baitz superpower. That may not be from your perspective like I just did it but for most people like reaching out to somebody like a firm reaching out to somebody like ovens or Tai Lopez and let alone offering a field where you get a piece of it is you know this line. So how do you even serve. Where to start. Say Babbo met these guys what were you doing and how did that start. Sure yeah that’s a great question. It’s it’s it is an underrated skill that I do like now kind of realize like having that ability
to connect with guys a big distribution that get a lot of people
coming in like I got a deal for you get the offer. Binita cut in line. So to say and get a conversation is very valuable to begin with. You know I used to have the brand WordPress guy so Sean WordPress guy Basar actually had it on Facebook like as my username and WordPress back in the day. You know a few years ago optimize press and all that was you know for click funnels really took a stride
even when the pages was just started. WordPress was still like the platform
right. And for the most part I built my brand around that like. I don’t necessarily recommend now like
doing your brand around a technology it is what got their attention because you know they’re like I need
WordPress stuff. So and you have to be able to back up your game right. I had a Web site where I logged in videos on all kinds that were pressed of a lot of
land. And I guess you know I have to go back a
little bit further and say like the very first line I got in the Internet marketing world was a fellow named Lewis house and this was like 5 or 6 years ago. Like it or before school. Yes. Right exactly. For me this is back in linked influence days with his company they were with Amy Porterfield and James Wedmore few other names like
that and really like at that point like I
didn’t have brands so I didn’t really have like this big or like a body of work really besides Web sites that I don’t for for like local businesses but I saw this guy Lewis Howze I just if you know Luas like he’s he’s got an interesting online Pirzada like it’s it’s fascinating to me. It’s like women. Women are trying to or child his lifestyle. He’s got this like aura of attraction. And so I saw this picture of him sitting in New Zealand and infinity pool and I said whatever he’s doing it was like
that scene in Wolf Wall Street where I was like you know I’ll quit my job today. Just show me. I think that was like my gut reaction like whatever he’s doing. I want to do that. I don’t I don’t know. Yeah I want that. So like with Louis it was funny because. This is really the advice point like if
you’re just kind of getting start where you’re
building relationships like there is a ladder like you have to build connections and get a body of work to be able to
present yourself you shouldn’t go right after the
main maybe Gary Vaynerchuk or maybe pick some middle level folks and at the time it’s kind of where
Louis was he didn’t have like the brand he does now. But basically what I did was I did quote unquote hustle right like I kept in contact got to know what their needs were and really from my skill set I was able to bring them things I just literally would go out build stuff and say hey I think this would be useful
for your brand. And it just so happened they were in a
launch one day and one of their platforms were precious crash. Like just in the middle of a big launch just quit working. It’s like 3:00 in the morning and they hit me up and we’re like. Can you help us out like
that no one’s going. And I just so happened to like like step up and be able to help me out and that build a relationship and eventually they hired me and that’s where I kind of got the ball
rolling. Now what I try to do and this is another small tip for folks who are getting clients or want to work with certain people. There’s there’s two ways to do it with Tai Lopez for instance. This is right when he was about to take
off I had a previous connection with him through a
mastermind but I wasn’t close with him. So what I did was I put together like a crazy mind map of his business like I went through dissect
it is fun. And I said Listen. I think this is where you’re losing a
bunch of money and that’s always the talking point that
gets people’s interests like they’ll talk about their copy don’t talk. Like literally it should be about like for toplevel entrepreneurs that’s what
they like. That gets their interests. You’re losing money. And many of them know this like they know they could be doing it better. But yeah I sent them this mind map and he’s like he basically it came down to can you just do this. Like I don’t know. This looks great. But can you just do it. I don’t have time to even think about it. So. So that’s really like now a big part of it is just looking at people that I know I want to work with and saying this is how we can help. And this is how you’re either losing money or I can make more. And it’s just results based selling 101. Instead of focusing on technology to copy the webinars whatever that does come up it says you’re making 50 grand a month. Here’s how you can make a hundred and here’s how I can help you do it. And that gets attention. Like even if you’re not a big brand if you
know your stuff if you have some skills and you want to work in that world like that that technique works. Yeah you know this isn’t only in view of its logo I want to talk about the software a lot of a lot of that actually is. Right. Like the idea that you don’t know your map is the mess that you currently have. It’s your current mix on the right. It’s literally like I use lucid chart at the time which is I still it’s kind of like a mind map tool whatever. Yeah. You know with fun Olympics it’s funny. I just pulled up recently on my funnels that I made it and Lisa char and moved it over to fun lyrics. And now I’m like so stoked because the
tracking Sussman’s are kicking in and like anyways that they’re definitely like that’s now. Like if I want to put together a proposal
that’s what I’m going to do. And another big thing just like a key
point is like pick your clients don’t let. Like I don’t do any inbound sales. Really. I get a lot of people now. It’s a blessing and a curse like that. Like want to hire me. But I don’t like sell it as a service
anymore because if I don’t want to build that machine. I guess is what I’m trying to say. So I don’t just take on anybody. I literally like research for months and months. And then another small tip for the
networking site like don’t go right for the kill like like
connect with them on social media platforms that
they’re on like interact be a human. First light takes 21 brand impressions they say for someone to recognize a brand. The same with a person like if you can start interact like you want to get hold grant. Like start interacting literally like on all the platforms he’s on so that he can at least get to see I heard this name before. Yeah I know. And that’s just something I’ve done for forever kind of naturally but now it’s a little more systematize. And if you really want to see if you
really want to cut in line. I did this once and it worked out great. There’s this guy knew you had a big
distribution list and I was like I want him to promote one
of my clients things but I couldn’t get a hold of them. I tried all this stuff. And I was literally like message them as
like I’ll pay you 2000 dollars for 50 minutes
of your time like I want to talk to you and and get to understand what your goals are in your business. And for most people like that’s a pretty good offer ended up being an hour and a half conversation by the way and Bigham and he’s like how do we like do this. You know that’s that’s part of the sales process too. But like it never hurts if you’ve got the budget for it to like
pay for the privilege that’s where it like masterminds are good and things like that. But eventually like it just starts
snowballing and people will come to you. Yeah I always say I’m a big believer myself in buying friendships. You know that especially in this space like when you want to lay with you know the people that you look got to respect like. Hey Clay you know you want to show that to somebody that actually I can hang out with you then show that you’re willing to embarrass as well. And so I’m a believer in that as well. Yeah OK. It’s a friendship it’s not a real
friendship it’s all you bonded over basketball or something like that. And now your
friends but ultimately you can’t stand out from everybody else. Ironically ended up playing like first time went up to see Tyler as he like
many play basketball for an hour. And I like soccer basketball is like I
hope you know this like should not be like on the test later because I don’t I’m not in it yet. But it is funny. You’re right. Like you know there’s business
relationships like those can develop into friendships. I like actually really like all my clients and getting to know them. But a lot of times you know the best friendships are built on mutual success. So you know that’s you. That doesn’t change like you can. You can still build friendships out of
these. Yeah yeah. So. So it’s a fun game like I recommend
anybody in fact I talked to a lot of agency people
that are like want to get into it. I said listen don’t change much about your
business. Like what you’re doing. It’s great if you
get good results like don’t change that but change the way you position yourself
like some of the best advice I ever got was like
Stop calling yourself a funnel expert top gun
somewhere. PESCA like when you’re talking to a client potential clients like revert. Like think of yourself and don’t be afraid to call yourself an
investor. Right. You’re investing especially from an
equity standpoint you’re investing time and energy into their business. And they’ve got it’s got to be worth your
time as well. Like I’ve worked with some pretty high
profile like New York Times bestseller that it
actually turned out to be a bad deal even though they had like a broad reach their audience just like their book. They didn’t really like what they didn’t
buy from them they weren’t condition that way. So I think it’s a learning process. But yeah it’s funny how. I think anybody can pull off that model
you just have to be willing to take a little more
risk from them. So let’s talk about them all a little a
little bit a little bit deeper into how to structure this time. You know you don’t have to go into the
specifics necessarily about your deal with Sam you deal with Tiger or in that sense but in general what these deals look like and how they actually were. Because I don’t I don’t see deals like
this. So the way I’ve done that and the way I’ve done this deal is no comment no go your follow up and go the system whatever help me gets pretty great results and then I get to the point where it’s
like OK you need so much more in life. I position myself. Wait wait wait. You need me so badly that I’m only going to work with you now. Say you if we create a structure right. Is that how you crochet or or do you kind of from the get go it’s like no no no we’re going to
start. And it’s going to be a partnership. And it’s an honor. So a big important kind of point here is that this is only on promotions
that I’m managing. So I don’t have a personal business right now like you you can obviously negotiate that. But like that puts all the burden of
results on me and I go about it pretty casual I mean I literally like kind of position in his attacks. Like listen I’m going to go and set up this business this is how we’ve
done in the past. And this is the results we could get. You know here’s the low and here’s the
high and I generally try to be conservative. And generally what I’ll do and I’m fully transparent with both sides of the equation but client or client be out I’ll negotiate a percentage on both sides depending on how big their distribution is or like how awesome that product is so it’s going to vary per person generally not big or the distribution the lower the
percentage that I’ll ask but a big thing I found like if you’re working with the right
people with the right profit margins. There’s usually not like any animosity. Like you could be making you know
generating millions and millions of sales as long as you’re like realistic with the percentage that you’re asking for
for the work you’re doing. You don’t become a liability like you
become a very strong profit center in their business because they don’t have to
pay you know 10 people on the staff. They don’t have this like you do are literally like managing everything. So I’ll go about the deal generally pretty
casual I’ll get it in paper and writing the percentages and stuff but I will do that all upfront and I’ll I’ll generally build out based on marketing that they’ve already kind of started like I’ll adapt it I’ll come in and change it. But I don’t I don’t like to work with products or distribution models that are tested. That’s that. Like if someone comes to me with an idea
like I want to launch this and they have already
launched. That’s too much risk on an equity
standpoint. Like that’s not proven right. So I’ll generally come in they’re already doing well conversion wise but I’ll bring in a new traffic peace and a new funnel piece. Now the next step in that is to take that independent funnel that you set up that’s kind of got its own world and branding and then bring that over to the
evergrowing side and you know maybe they are Adsteam or you hire your own team to start running traffic to it. So that’s another way to keep the longevity going. So a lot of my clients they will start out with like a launch model and then I’ll take it put everything into
an evergreen funnel and find people who run traffic for it in the margins go down then. But it’s just very consistent lamplit answer questions directly like I’m I’m
pretty upfront without words like I don’t generally like mincing words. Yeah yeah I saw I saw your really really closely together which showed me your skill set. Right. Popularising is mastered over the years and I know that you kind of mentioned that was a problem writing is the thing that has made you so valuable. Sure yeah and I would I would definitely you know I’d review that because I’ve said it like. In the streets up on you right. Like you know as an entrepreneur that
copywriting it’s it’s it’s something like when you’re building funny lyrics you weren’t
necessarily like thinking about the copy directly as you were probably like coming up with it like it just it just kind of falls into place a lot of
times. But then you look back and you say well I really did feel like I watched your upswell video for the
Pro. And it’s funny because I really don’t like
upswell concepts like I’m not like him. I rarely actually buy into products it’s not like I’m not I don’t know and watching your video like I could tell
you understood topic. Listen you know we’re in this. The other thing that you like went into
the benefits of the pro piece and it really spoke to me because I’m your
target audience right. Well a lot of people will do that
naturally but as you dig deeper like it’s funny 80 percent of these books every year on
copywriting and literally like these guys right here I’m diving into the concept of a story like trying like a big part of what I’m trying to do now is like my dad explaining this to me he’s a doctor and I kind of like I was like why you didn’t get a doctorate. Why even worry about getting to that level
of education. And for what it’s worth I graduated like a
two point seventy day a socialist who never made it but he said like everything up to a doctorate. You’re learning as much as
you can about discipline. You know how when you get your doctorate. Your job is to add to that discipline and that’s the line is in the academic world. Add to that some now like I’m like how can I dig deeper into what copywrite like what makes copy really work. Because for most people like just getting the fundamentals right like what
makes a good headline. What gets attention. What’s different some features benefits
how can you tie in counterintuitive ideas and all that like that. To me is what ended up like making a lot of my campaigns work more so than the tech the landing
pages. I love design. Like you can tell by that page that like I do really enjoy making good design but that page could be
literally written down in a text document and still convert. That’s the goal right. But then. Yes. What’s fascinating is Tai Lopez I recommend this everybody go look at his silly Lamborghini video right. It transcribed and then highlight like each sentence in like draw a line out to a notepad and write out like this site palagi or the method or like do your best to break down what he’s doing. It’s only like four and a half minutes but it’s fascinating. I did this because I was like dude this
guy is just weird. Like that was my initial reaction like
what is he trying to do here. But then you like go into like the
persuasion methods and the psychology and the social aspects of it and you’re kind of like saying this is like modern day frikken Cialdini stuff so it’s fascinating. Like I I didn’t go after becoming a copywriter. It just so happened if I wanted to get
good results for my clients so that I could get paid. I had to get good a copy. And now like me putting together guide
uncorks on Koppy is about trying to distill it down into a way that I can actually help people who don’t want to learn copy
follow some methodologies that I use. And one of those methodologies I’ll just
share with like anybody that’s listening this works really well for conversion. And. I don’t have a really good name for it but I like to I guess referred to as like the counterintuitive. Copy structure I guess I’ll come up with a better name. That’s part of
marketing I. But by the end of this. Right. Yeah exactly. But it’s it’s really just looking. Looking at your audience and looking at. What is that what do most people think is the right way to move forward. Like with Tai Lopez his audience is huge lineal baseline and they’ve been preached for years like college is the way. So the counter-intuitive look at that is that college isn’t the way. So then at that point you have to get the audience to have that. What I like to call the eureka moment like kind of get this hair back like up on the back of your neck like and say. Like literally you’ve been lied to for
most your life. There’s nothing wrong with college. But for most people the truth is you’re putting yourself in mounds of
debt and you’re not getting any real world
experience. So here the counter to the point is here’s the other way here’s a different journey. You can go on and that works really well in in copy and in some of the e-mails like I
literally have like thousands e-mails of written for
clients and some are like 1000 to 2000 words like they’re really long
e-mails. And they worked really well. I’ve tested like sure like punchy direct marketing e-mails and they get more clicks but they get way less conversions and. And it’s funny like some of my copy and you might like you like this reads
like a blog post by a psychologist or something. But at the end of the day people especially under 40 they’re getting much wiser to marketing like that. The big warning like stuff. It’s a it’s a red flag to them as much as anything else. You will be able to sell to the bottom percent of intelligence level with that direct marketing stuff. And I do still use it a lot especially in like clothes and stuff. But smelling smelling and selling to a smarter segment of your audience actually brings
better customers. It’s it’s much more reliable consistency even if the percentage is
lower and you’re just going to feel a lot better
about the orchard too because it’s not so quote unquote sales. Yeah. So one of the things that you mentioned
there a lot of people don’t realize and I learned this a little while back is this idea of counter counter intuitive onset as other innovative idea which is really unique and present people live with some sort of new opportunity. You know Russell runs and talks of this
all the Times mentions the word new opportunity. But first or not the last at the end of the day is about realizing that if you want people to jump in and you want people to actually take
action you can’t just sell them something that is an improvement as to like hey later you could go and get a business degree but like here’s a better degree have to go and get a degree right. Like instead it’s like here’s a branding opportunity. There’s this brand new thing that you don’t even think of it right. A lot of the reason why I think politics has kind of taken off and went on is because I also realized that very very from the beginning was like. You know data analytics is crap. Nobody likes it it’s a headache. Here’s this whole way of looking at stuff to figure out what maybe money was losing
the money. So we’re only told you have to look at spreadsheets of this resume was number one. Right. Most businesses forget that most
businesses forget that they need to find the wage decision themselves as another. Yeah. And it’s funny because like. Some people will see it very quickly like
I looked at funny lyrics and it is funny because I’d like seen your ads on Instagram for a while and like I’m just a national skeptic. I’m like This is a too good to be true. This is I swear not a pitch for analytics but it was funny because I just like I ignored it for a while. Then it’s like you know what. Because I feel like I use Google Analytics like five different tools just to try to get a picture because I’m a visual guy. Like any time I can get a visual look is something in the fact that you
guys is analytics like show on the arrows is like my jam. Like I’m so excited to see that to its full potential because otherwise what I have to do is go into google analytics or any number of programs like manly build a spreadsheet and then draw it out and I’m telling you I probably spent a thousand hours in the last two years just doing that. And I still don’t know what that’s going
on. And just a point I want to show you this
because I think you guys would like this or know you’re doing to try this out. I’ll take a picture of the bookshelf and put it in the comments on that show. But this is the funniest book because this is this is the worst title of any book. It says effective direct advertising the
principles and practices of producing direct
advertising for distribution by mail or otherwise. All right. And this is a book that was published in nineteen eighteen WA and I got it because I was just curious is like are
things much different right. And it’s hilarious because the only thing this change really is some
of the terminology. There’s a section in here literally like
the title is like the value of your list and it’s a section on how to secure your mailing list against fires like it’s
hilarious. Like literally like you should take your your physical address list of your customers and keep it in a bank and some like that. But there’s a section in here about that some funny language for it but basically like the effectiveness of teaching as an advertisement tool. And that’s really what that
counter-intuitive. That’s like one framework of teaching
people like here’s what most people think. Here’s the reality. Here’s why that what most people think is dangerous. Right. And here’s what you can do about
it. Like that’s teaching 101 like that’s going into a classroom and teaching. And they talk about that in this book from
1918. Like it’s not brand new it’s just people avoid like learning. How to teach. And you know it’s Frank Kern 101. It’s like give them everything
you’ve got. Get that law reciprocity. And that’s why it works so well that’s
like this if we were to go into a pitch about
something like it would work so well because we’re
teaching here. And honestly it’s what Tai Lopez. Well that’s what Sam Obinze does so well. And that’s my advice. Any person as a client filter it’s like can they teach it. Well you can always go in and add benefits and features and things like that. But I guarantee you like if you sat down and taught funnel analytics you’d teach them just about as
good as anybody if not better than most right. So having the ability to do that. It’s why when I take on a client I go
through all their core stuff I learn it so that I can get to the point that I feel like I
can teach it because that’s that’s really the foundation of the best salespeople in the world. You know like super nerdy but like there’s a Harvard Business Review
article will try to link it down to comments like do you think the best salesperson I already
gave away the answer. Like what’s the average answer to that
question like who are the best salespeople in the world. It’s generally the average answer is like
people who can network well right like people go on the
golf course. Yeah. Yeah. So right. But they’re the second best salespeople
the role they’re the second best the. That’s what’s that. Yeah teachers are the best but also they got a little more specific
like Peep sales people who take their buyers through the buying process. So they say all right man you’re getting
signed up for fun analytics today. First things first you’ve got to
understand a little bit about what the big picture what we’re not just about backing up we’re about getting you
to understand the relationship between your final pieces and also you know like you can go in and teach them the value of specific features. Those are the best salespeople in the
world. There’s a huge like a great study on it. I’ll try to we to from that that Harvard Business Review article. And it’s really like I try to keep that
mind whenever I’m writing copy it’s like if I’m not
teaching them something they didn’t know or a different perspective paradigm
whatever you want to call it. I did it effectively reach the goal that I wanted. Now you can sprinkle in all the other
marketing stuff like you’re always like Get
Attention all that stuff. But if you get attention to
show them something that isn’t valuable to them then you’re just getting attention for attention say right. So yeah that’s like my rants on
copywriting. I could talk about it for spoiler mention. You know you can just go that sort of thing. I was like probably you
know what parents are if you can you can convince the best parents or teachers you can convince a child without saying like I told you so and that’s why you have to do it. But if you can convince a child to do something and because of competition that kind of knew that process. That’s a long time to have. Ultimately when you’re you don’t
have any kids by the way you have to to your SO. I’M SORRY. Here’s the reason why I major in this and now I’m starting to like it’s starting to happen. I’ve got to like her. I’ve got to tell her hey put your shoes on. Listen you don’t want your feet to get
wet. It’s like OK. Well crowd. Exactly. You think about it actually you start to realize it. Yeah that’s all it is. That’s all really right. Yes. And then now you dive into what you just mentioned but you’re studying or reading a lot more on lunches storytelling and there’s there’s no better way to teach them through stories. Right. Just teaching facts is not going to help people when you’ve got this book talk like Ted. It’s a it’s a book by a guy who consults on TED Talks and he breaks down in this because I think we all like TED talks. We don’t know why. Like there are
definitely like feel good like bull crap sometimes like yeah. But the psychology of that is what you want in sales right you want that
emotion. The number one most watched TED talk like literally brings tears to my eyes. Like it’s so powerful it’s the one
on education by Sir Richard something rather. And it’s funny like he there’s a section here that everybody should read about. Pathless Eidos whatever those things are like the parts of you. And he breaks down in Ted talks. He literally transcribed like a hundred of
them and studied them. Seventy five percent of those 18 minute TED talks are stored right and sprinkled in with that is old the stuff that they want to get across. But that’s like that’s the first thing it
teaches us how to structure a good story. And that’s the funny thing about all these
books they’re all on on story and plot. Some people take it so literally in
marketing that they like literally write like this ten page story. That’s not nice. Like that’s that’s like a good practice to see how you could put together a story. But at the end of the day like
you’re going to lose some people because it’s not about them. But like the The Hero’s Journey part the part where you’re trying to convince
this person that this is useful to them is where your you’re putting them in the driver’s seat as the character in the story. It was like a big kind of like interesting eureka moment for me as like I’m writing a
lot of times as my products being the hero or my service where the hero is really the person reading. And then your product or yourself your brand whatever becomes the parts of the story that help our hero get to their destination. So it was like a an interesting take away from studying storytelling and it’s something like especially with webinars like if you go and dissect Sam Obinze weapon R which is one of the most profitable pieces of marketing I think is out there for a dollar and dollar out. He even told me once he was talking to one
of his mentors he’s in the billionaire world. And he said like internet marketing is
like the most profitable industry he’s ever seen. Like everything else has
crazy like upfront costs. Employee cost that his first you know ten million dollars in
sales he had like one employee you know. So like looking at that web and are that piece of marketing it’s 75 percent sort and it’s his story and the story of his customers. So. You know there’s all kinds of things that people watching this and the agency side
of things can think about when it comes to getting into the nitty gritty marketing. It doesn’t have to be crazy technical at first. In fact it shouldn’t. The problem with this even though you have an awesome
funnel you know funnel to start out with like the core thing that gets the
first sale and then build out from there until you
get that for sale you’re just guessing at the rest. So I think you have to prove a concept right like I name nothing actually really matters unless you can actually make a sale has every day their onset. Absolutely. Yeah. You can talk about cooperating for a long time you can talk to all this stuff for a really long time because I think ultimately I agree with you it’s the number one. It’s not so much probably ratings whether
the sell through video and with your words or so with you know like speaking or writing or. No it doesn’t really matter. It’s about understanding psychology
understanding nuances what it takes to convince somebody to change their entire mindset system in that system and then also rebuild it with something that they never even
thought or heard. Which is fascinating. That’s why software is so fun to sell it
like it is the ultimate. Just like you’ve got the default of like
this is a tool you can use and it’s going to help you do this. Like that’s awesome. Like I just software is so fun because
it’s it’s it has that built in utility. It gets a little more abstract and yet like a product and stuff and it’s a little higher bar
entry sometimes that’s why there’s all these different
steps. But you want to know the one thing I can recommend for folks who like they hate copywriting messes like they’re more like funnel phones they’re more like
agency dealing this stuff. The one thing I can recommend is not to hire a Clocky writer but to hire I use up work for this. I’ll go out and hire a psychologist. I found a retired psychologist there’s actually a lot of these online upwards. You had a background and getting grants for university and he was a teacher of psychology and he wanted like 50 bucks now he’s
retired just wanted some extra work to do. And I gave them writing prompts I said
convince me from a psychological point of view that X Y Z is true and he cried out like a thousand word. Teaching lesson on y x y z was. Like why you I’m trying to think of a good example. But like like why colleges how you always go about it because it’s
just such an easy. Like why college is a bad idea for people who aren’t going for a professional degree and who go out final this research and that copy became like the middle ground for my marketing. So I would write the introduction with like the hook you know I like all
this stuff this must be in the marketing and the clothes which is just a call to
action. But you’re right 90 percent of that stuff right. And it’s something like everybody. Like hiring a good copywriter is hard for me. Like I won’t do it because it’s less equity in your life unless you get it. But is it like the best copywriters out there are writing copy for themselves or partnerships. They’re hard. And so go going in like looking for it was just here is like me and I’ll I’ll try this because
90 percent of the stuff I’m writing a lot of times
it’s psychology mindset stuff. And I think it’s like hey I’m forty five bucks an email and I give them a bonus because I just
kind of fell that he’s like it’s not about the money I just like once
I’m I’m like I know it’s like there are all these writers you know whether or not they’re good. And then they charge the type of sales. And they’re like yeah I learned as
studying writing I’ve done all this when I actually shot his debut. And yet they were all like all of us. It’s like there’s you know there is pros Tiphaine out the butt for good copy. Like there are some really good Reon but like it really cuts into your margins like I’m
a I’ll be honest I’m a lazy person and I like high art. The laziness I have to solve with tools and strategies to say Ali were probably like two to five hours a day on client stuff. If that on average and then most of the time on spending like
researching and trying to learn as I enjoy that too but I’ve set up systems in my business to do that I used to have a
couple of employees and run like a kind of more structured business but I kind of hated it. Like the last straw was somebody is like
well you need to start getting a salary out of this
instead of just kind of having your business
account. And I was like you know like from a
lifestyle like I just don’t want that. Yeah like my profit margin now for the way around business. My clients are happy. So I had to find a way to do that without
a ton of employees. So you’ve got to get creative right. And you know I do recommend and I’m not saying go out and fire all your employees because like
there is legit like there’s people who want to run a business
like that for me. I don’t. So I had to find another way. But look at your infrastructure and find ways to like maybe you don’t need an Adsteam maybe you
can outsource that to a company full agency that does that and have your clients pay
for that and you focus on just one part of your business right. So you know there’s a lot of ways to run that type of business as well. And one last thing on the equity side like anybody who runs an agency or like does funnels as a business you can do a trial like you can go to your clients right now who have a similar customer base but aren’t competitors. And build a promotion where they promote
each other take 10 percent on each side. No client a real estate company client is a financial. Services company. They have customer lists. You write a couple of e-mails of landing
page where they sell each other services. They both promote each other. One week one promotes a next week he promotes a new the idea and you’re getting 20 percent of the profits on that right away. Anybody who has more than a few viands can do that right away because it’s just fueling that promotion and you can you can dabble in the equity model as opposed to what I really like that idea too. I like what you know because here’s the reality. A lot of businesses have just looking for more Shinsei who are looking for other wasteful or otherwise unproven revenue and why. Always you know focus yes always good to sell all products and all that stuff. The idea of course I got this guy over here both benefit from each other. Why don’t they just broker that deal and learning from each other and that’s a fantastic idea. Love it you know. You know like name one of the number one affiliate marketers in the
world is that people don’t necessarily know. It’s Tony Robbins. And it’s funny like you know the money is just literally titled Money where you really blink. Does a disclaimer in the first like I know
percentages in most of these companies that I
recommend what I bought. You literally like makes that selling always like when I bought into
these companies because I believe in them so much and he sells a million copies of his book
Whatever It Is gives away. It’s just a sales book for those companies. And I guarantee you like buncher those readers said you know how do
you let’s me your 401k over to this company maybe 10 million dollars. News gets a percentage of all that is only Robbs. I thought it was friggin brilliant. So that’s like creative deal making by the
way that’s like. That’s really what I like
doing Affiliate Marketing. Call whatever you want but it’s just a different way to look at it we’re created dealmaking. Yeah and everybody can do it. Like it’s you just have to like look at
what you had like might. It’s funny of course just to a little
something for sale probably for another year or whatever it’s called Smart leverage. And the reason I call it that is because
like literally the assets you have in front of you can be worth. Ten times more if you know how to move them around in the right way. You have to change much like
literally just like pivoting things and moving them around relationships like I used to just connect people and say like hey you guys so much stuff and they go make a million dollars and I’d be like. And like and even get dinner you know like it was one of those things like I’m not opposed to doing and like there’s nothing wrong with that. But like that’s when the working smarter part comes in and you say like all right. I think they both can make money together. Let me be the one who becomes the pivot point broker the deal and actually make it a big benefit for
them because they don’t have to do as much work. Right. So like there’s there’s plenty of people watching this video who have those assets already you just got to
sit back get a nice beer and brainstorm ways to connect those dots differently. Like it’s oh I’ll wildlife you. Can I ask you are you are you the reason
that some of us deal together. Oh yeah yeah I’ve broken all of that. Well so it’s funny because like I was
working with Tai helping to monetize that list
that are like Ludt sans product you’ve never done an
affiliate the first one and went on to do several million dollars. Don’t want to say the full amount but it’s still going like we still promote each other and stuff and it’s wild because that’s just optimizing. Audience is he does have to make a whole
new audience for that. It’s not direct selling because we’re
putting the Web in our we’re only like point 0 0 1 percent of his audience makes it all the
way to call the action so they don’t even know most of
the time that they’re being sold. It’s not like sending them to
scanning sales page words like you want to make a
bunch of money. It’s like that relationship. I knew both of them separately and I could’ve just said Hey you guys
should connect these cool stuff. But I literally like I helped sample the women are together. I wrote all the e-mails for Ty. I wrote like communicated between them and they didn’t ask it like like. Had that friction. I’ll tell you like most a lot of my job is
just like managing crazy people you know like they’re just like nuts like
they have their interest interest eccentricities. So he’s like a peacemaker like my job is to make sure everybody gets what they’re supposed to get along. But yeah that that deal came about because I knew Stan’s product was awesome. I know Sam sell. He actually showed me some of his sales
numbers for his like 20000 person list and it was the highest earnings per lead
I’ve ever seen on anything. And it was not even a weapon or is like a product launch formula style launch. He’s like dude like. Dude you don’t even understand how much
this is worth. I’m not taking credit for his doubling down in like going in just making it. He blew it way out of the water on Facebook. But like we had a lot of success from that. Like it was awesome like you know I hope to replicate that a few more times because I’m definitely the highest paid consultant
in his business. Now to at point that I was like worried it
was like Man this is becoming kind of a
liability for them. But the profit margins are so great. It’s an old product right. Software you know your cost per sale isn’t that high. You know in the long run margins are great for software. So like I still recommend people to like. Be an affiliate for the tools that you’re
using. I’m a big funnel affiliate because I use it all the time like. Don’t be afraid to sell the tools you use as well as an affiliate. You know stuff like that. Yeah. And vice versa. You’re like if you’re like for me for example I’m selling software you know you know everyone who’s using one of the
software is the marketer and that are there at
least they consider themselves a marketer
summary. But you know brokering deals and looking at opportunities for people like me were also saying well I’ve got the software and selling the software I’m growing this
company great. But like there’s other cross from those things that you can do to keep getting value because a lot of people are afraid to do cross promotions and stuff like that because
they’re afraid. Well you know that may not be an in line with my brand and it may not be like forget your brand forget your own ego and realize that ultimately what matters is on listen your customers. People who are serving. And is this cross promotion going to help them get closer to their
goals. Is this proselyting going to help them in any way shape or form. So if it does. Then you’re actually doing Bowdler business and your customers a disservice by not talking about by not doing them promotion by not talking or trying to share that. So I definitely something to tell people who run into that
headache like they’re little afraid to do that. Like you can always just say listen like you can be fully transparent. Listen I don’t. Aye. I. I value so much our relationship. Maybe this is an e-mail that I want to be
transparent that this is an affiliate promotion. However I’m going to give you the raw link
as well. You can click here if you don’t want me to
get part of this but I still think it’s great for you here. Just go to this Web site you can buy
without my feeling like current actions could that a lot. He would help with that is that kind of transparency stuff actually does a lot more to like actually increase conversion rates overall. First not having it like those are some
really smart strategies you can use. And then also like I say another kind of magic sauce in what I do from the affiliates
standpoint is a lot of the copy and branding and marketing that I do with these guys or promote each other is I build that bridge right. Like I teach y so x y you know client A’s promoting. We talk about that in the promotion itself and we almost always build a separate branded funnel that’s called branded so that it’s not just like check out the sales space. It’s like we’re doing this together and bringing you along for the ride. And it actually it converts a lot better
than it does straight like you know launch promotion. Yeah I all those types of pages and some of them are from your consumer standpoint you look at it and you’re like oh this is actually a look around to find Ispahani make some
money this is actually spend time together and like some of the deals specifically make the deals there doesn’t really matter the very title and some of those logo on the top like oh like Sam Olens actually did this
specifically for Kaplow right now. Exactly. Go ahead. Because I mean like you know that that’s a part that I think a lot like any of them just straight like list building markers here can benefit from
like instead of promoting something new every
week. Like go out and find your core products that have good margins and you like and then build ecosystems around them like click funnels I’ve built out a pretty crazy funnel as an affiliate to promote it. And same with Sam Owens like I have my own funnels
that I build with these guys. I should spend more time on them to be 100 percent honest like kind of like the dentist. Like the last person who we’re going to
see kind of thing. But that’s really kind of the transition
I’m in now as I’m trying to actually do a bit more of what I do for them for
myself because I’ve been building a decent sized
list things like that. But yeah that’s that’s kind of where I’m
not in my business to be 100 percent honest. I’m looking to actually watch my own stuff and build that ecosystem as well and take the things I’ve built over the years and help people with that. But yeah like you don’t have to promote 50 different products a year to be make millions as an affiliate in a couple and really double down on them and build ecosystems around them did
really well. Yeah definitely. So look I’m conscious of your time and thank you so much for
sharing all this wisdom. So let’s wrap it up. Somebody asks Can we go listen to pull books on your desk. So it’s only a guess. Give us a list of like three to five quotes that are just like you. Because they’re amazing. So I’ll show you what I’ll do. I will take a picture. I like you and I’ll take a picture of my
bookshelf and stuff and and post it in the in the comments thread
here. You know from a mindset standpoint it’s
funny because like I’m sure you’re in that same boat
where it like most entrepreneurs are like you think
that you’re missing one thing that if you solve it like it’s going to make
everything else so much easier. And it’s it’s funny like I’m plagued with that old time like what am I doing in
my mind that’s wrong. It’s fascinating. Like I think that this book I haven’t
finished yet. It’s called Willpower doesn’t work by Benjamin Artie. He’s a pretty cool guy. I haven’t actually met him but talked a little online. And I actually is the first book that I just read the introduction is like this is enough for me. Like as far as as. Profound shift in how I view things he said. Like there’s a line in here I love. Basically like the concept is like
willpower shouldn’t be your strategy of choice like you shouldn’t plan will power to get things
done. He brings out this you know to be frank. Willpower is for people who haven’t decided what they actually want in their
lives and that like her home as a crap like I
really haven’t committed to them what I actually want. Just kind of like trying to figure this
stuff out. And there’s nothing inherently wrong with that but it builds and natural struggle like motivation. Like that’s a really good one. I really like books on storytelling because I like trying to apply that into my marketing. I’ll be 100 percent transparent and it read 98 percent use them as reference a lot of times and I will say that last question time is really really all those votes in this garage. So if you sit down. Here’s the one thing I I kind of have as a requirement when I work for
clients. They have to drink their own kool aid. Like I don’t really care. Like if they’re like Perfect’s like. But if they’re preaching something I
really want them to like do it in the first time since it ties like a social life work thing. I was kind of like looking for this. I’m like dude you know Is he full of crap. And it was funny. We get there or I get there. We come in and literally is like come on in to the
dojo and it’s like there’s a dojo guy there like doing workout stuff and I said I like fight with a World Class Dojo dude I ended up
like cracking my rib eye. But then like after that we walk out and he’s learning chess with a grand master chess person and I’m sitting there like okay. Then we go play basketball with these girls who whatever like it’s not my thing but it’s over. And then like he shows me his bookshelf and he starts going through Evernote and I’ve never seen this many notes in an
Evernham like this dude is like a machine. Right. So when he says he reads a book today does he go through every word
for word a book a day. I don’t think so. I mean he’s more like you know 80 20 rule like pull the chapters in the sections and read the thing that I
learned with reading like each paragraph like read the first sentence and lessons and if it feels like a good chunk of
content read the whole paragraph if not move on the point and then I’m like I’m a big note taker like I want for your notes. So it’s to be a little more specific like books are always going to contain. Especially with copyrighting stuff they’re
going to give you a lot of the rules and basics in case studies like that. But what I really love to do is go out and you guys did this amazingly and final lyrics where you have you’re like fuddle breakdown section. Yeah I went through and downloaded all of those because I have a folder literally of hundreds of funnels all the assets all the screenshots I download all the
videos I get them transcribed. I study them because that’s like my learning style is looking at
what’s already out there especially when I know
that it converts well. And I kind of stole that from Sam Owens a
little bit like he did a by product launch formula. He literally got dressed Walker’s videos transcribed and then like just change that
now. The structures there I think eventually he
bought it but it was funny I was like That’s friggin brilliant. So like if your building learning all that like a go out there and look at what’s working now because it
changes pretty quickly. To pay attention to ads save them save screen shots and then study them like like old school print them out. I like draw I’ll I’ll tear apart most than I really like. And just like pull the chapters in into like a three ring binder and highlight and stuff because I want to
just get the meat of it for repetition. Are you doing this. This is a good book by the way. We’re sure we’ve heard of it. That was another like attempt to solve the
inner turmoil of like why why not motivated to do this. Yeah. Like that’s all really good and then Mediacom is kind of like a fun
way to go and look at like how people are writing. Look at the the most interactive stuff and see like what they’re doing and you’ll start building like a library
of structures that you can use in your own
marketing. That’s literally like my book that I’m
putting together. And it’s just like a library of structures that I pull from because I write a lot of copy and I’m pretty lazy so I like to just you
know pull from what I know. All pretty lazy. To be honest I don’t have to be or else we’re going to just kind of get
stuck in a one of the least efficient ways. You have something for you though that can help with your inner turmoil like you know a little bit. And this is something I’m sure of is before now we’re getting beyond context here but I’ll share it. So. I remember that I was there in 2011 and I was in the same boat. I was I graduated as Engineer. I was an engineer. High school I guess whatever. That’s what I studied. And I was working as an engineer. I was. This is why I started learning about Internet marketing and building you know the idea of our business and whatnot. I put this Web site called Quality survival livestock. And I was like I have no passion or anything about survival matters. The reason I did it was because my my roommates had all of these different survival outdoors and in my mind I was like because I had just learned about Vescio and organic traffic and stuff like that. And in my mind I was like no island 2012 this summer. This was the world. So I was like if I go to this website right now because of all that
survival and create the articles and click keywords like by 2012 you know people are going to be asked to my website cannot happen I only made by 23 cents on that Web site after I did that. I was a business network like oh I won you lose. But there’s a lot of passion. What does that mean that I want to even and do it my time and I sat down with my roommate my roommate who was working for an advertising agency and the owner the founder of the
advertising. They were going around all around 10 million or so. And I sat down with him and I asked him how did you figure out that advertising was the passion. How did you figure out that advertising
was. Well you know to me he said don’t get it wrong. Advertising is not really what I’m passionate about. Actually buzz for this thing he’s driving mean every single day forward is number one is I love being in a room with creative people were smarter than me who are very right brain it’s their
brains that number two is I look to me. I love to lead it’s meaning and so a vision and knowing either person recently that the number Regans. I love diversity. I look to be working on meetings all the time. And number four is that I love to be able to collaborate and be my own boss and. Have that flexibility in my life. It just so happens really in advertising. See this before things. Well there’s a lot of other things that it thinks I just chose happened to choose. And after I had that conversation within the primaries shifted everything I walked away and I looked up. I was late walking down
the street. I remember clearly as if I could be piscine literally I when I went all night to get a notebook and I was like what my
court for things that happen every single day and I didn’t get any just
cited. And I took this notebook and I wrote more bills. It buys freedom. Right. So I can learn something new every single day. I feel fulfilled. I feel a sense of
fulfillment the feeling is so right. And this has changed for me over the
years. But the second one is still if I can build something in me that’s why I went into engineering the
first place is I love building I’m rich in the steps and then you see this thing and it’s like it’s like a ghost from this draw I’m on my way or maybe that’s why I love so much. I draw on a white board and then boom their life under their
skills. Right. And finally we having these types of stations having conversations not just about
business but about relationships about life about
philosophy. Just having these hopes and. When I see somebody have an aha moment that feels he gets nearsighted gets me a. Reader Lee was at the time. I just feel like I’m free feel like I’m I can do what I want when I want to you know be a cannibal to somebody I don’t have to show unless somebody tells me. And as I kind of started looking at my opportunities and my projects and things that I was
doing I started evaluating them around these
four boxes. And to this day I lived and breathed by this guy. I draw on like I literally just draw all this bill bias and that’s the now reader. Yeah you see reading now. Now that’s because I realize freedom is not actually what
people see. People say they see freedom but it’s actually what they do with the freedom that they see. So that was one of the biggest like
depressing points in my life where I like Anwar a ton of time and money and I was like oh this actually is not
what I thought it would be like evil evil chase money and freedom. But as soon as you asked them OK if you have all the money in the world and you have freedom what would you do then they start saying oh well I’ll do whatever I want in the world. Yeah exactly. I travel the world well the
travel the world like you don’t need the freedom to travel the world. You know in that sense way. But I literally look at mine and I have like a line down here and it’s all over. And I sit there and I actually say OK I’m looking in these projects and these opportunities. And I say it does it. Am I going to work if I do this. Am I going to build something. Am I going to have any sort of device. Am I going to have any sort of
freedom or at least it was freedom at that time. SIEGEL And I have to do it. It goes in the other box and I try to find somebody else. Because ultimately I know that it’s not. It’s like get me right. So in your case I I sit there and I look at you and I say hey you
clearly love to. Write something that is something that you enjoy. You also clearly love to the creative aspect the. You’re definitely a very creative guy and have a creativity as one of your thoughts. It’s like if you can do
something it is creative. It seems like it’s going to feel you know these are really two boxes for yourself. Now looking at your life and sort of looking at your projects and sort of what you were doing ask
yourself why am I feeling these fossils. Here’s the funny thing about this exercise
I’ve been doing this since 2009. Like the weather. And I’ve lived in this for. It’s not fine it’s not really. I have a buddy who same guy on all survival lives. And he was I sat down with him one day. This is about a year or two years ago. And we I knew something was like a fish jaw. You just was happy and you just something was off. But it was his job. It was actually that one of his boss’s
adventure and he hadn’t had any adventure in the
last like eight months. Like he didn’t do anything outdoors. He was just in this routine. And as soon as you realize that that was that was one of those boxes he went back
and. OK now I’m making you want to add something into my eventual box every single month. Right. So now late and now he’s happy everything schools the rest of his life was good it wasn’t
about his job. It was the fact that he just was lacking something right. People find that people go through life a little bit too much by trying to figure out that one thing. What is the one thing that is driving what is mine. You know we look at things you look at
entertainers you look at somebody like a things like you figured it out when he was young. Basketball is one thing. Right. But it’s not. If you were to break down LeBron James is probably being active right teammates and playing people in college. You know I’m not statistician. Competition definitely is. You know it just so happens that
basketball feels that way. So I wouldn’t I wouldn’t do that exercise for yourself. And you also realize that actually there’s a lot of pieces in your life that you purchase is probably one or two boxes of your life are not actually in the process right now. And I sure because I know that if I do life like SRAM I’m happy you know. And it’s funny you say that because like
you know there’s there’s boxes that like. Either society or or just like our own external expectations kind of defined for us. And I think a lot of people find
themselves you know feel like they’re trapped in
those boxes. So maybe you know they they think they have to have like I used to think I want to travel a lot
like I used to think that was one of my bosses and then I realized like I don’t really want to travel I just want to be able to dress like I want. You know I haven’t gone on a vacation in five years. I live in San Diego where it is my vacation right like I used to wear. Like I wanted to travel. And so it is funny like they do change as you say but a lot of times we define them wrong and that’s killer. I’m going to definitely do that. It helps to kind of look like rebel too. Like I’ll look at a box like that’s my box and then it’s not really my box and I try to fit into it. The funny thing is I should not be insert boxes like just that they say like Focus on your strengths not your weaknesses right away. Part of what I do is like dig into my weaknesses like I try to fight it like like it’s my mission right. It’s just exacerbated the problem. But but yeah you’re right. And I think everybody. Everybody can benefit from doing that. I haven’t heard in that way but really liked that. I’ll I’ll give that a go. Good for you. You know Scott over Yeah yeah yeah. I remember like I did this. I’ve shared this exact same story is right before the law is business like you said. And it is trash. Yeah yeah. Scruffier right now and to see some Tronto are pretty good friends and were walking down the waterfront one day and his business was doing really well. There were still yawningly
more six figures a month. And you just were chatting inside and he’s not happy and I don’t know what’s up and I told him this story and instantly asked and like from your gut tell me what what
yours are like. If I remember correctly it was like in a
big evolution like innovation evolution creation and something else. And yeah I don’t know what the other one. And he was spending all his time living in creation but he was the only way he was evolving was by taking LSD and then spent his mind that way. That was his form trying to fill that box. What he didn’t realize it. Right. And he was intimating he wasn’t doing anything that
fulfills him. And when we started to realize that he’s like fuck like I have just been sitting here all living in his creation box neglecting the other stuff that fills me. And no wonder are miserable no one are not happy. And then he went to bed he got water and then you had an amazing future pony and then he decided to blow everything up and moved to the states. So we’ve been meaning meaning to get together the islands just
north of me but I haven’t actually known him for a long time so you kind of just on online and it is interesting you can kind of tell when people make a shift. Yeah. And in it is a mindset thing but it’s also just like. I don’t want to say direction but it’s just like Yeah it’s right like
where where you’re actually like spending your
time and not like forcing yourself through cement. You know the region as opposed to like getting in a river in a boat. And it is fast and you can tell when
people hit that point and that’s that circular buys I think. I think we all like like really. Take take a bit more time to do that right now without. Necessarily like I’ll look at that as a burden sometimes a bit like well I’ve
got to figure this allowance the next year. It doesn’t have to be that complex like it
must be now. Usually you know gets forgotten like if you were to read out right now you will 100 percent sit down and you’ll be like you’re going to tell you what they are when you get back on your life and look back over these things look back on the projects the disasters that fill me about because I was building something like for me like build is no longer. It’s shit. It’s the words architect right. I no longer really yielding. I no longer enjoy the process of. Building and doing the sets. Now I know architecting like I like letting other people like me because I got it and I’ve done it now. That’s what I like when I look at my team and stuff. I get to go out and buy spots because I’m constantly advising and focusing on working with themetc. So you know forget politics it’s not about politics. It just so happens that building this tech company fills these four things for me. That’s really interesting. APTA is definitely with the biggest struggle I’ve been facing
launching this course of mine is kind of like the wall you hit where the build part of it becomes so overwhelming that it scatters your brain like you just say I can’t go any further. This is it. And it has been. So maybe there’s some shifts there in the
way you actually look at these pieces of the puzzle without necessarily. You know letting the actual work take over the process like look at it in more of those visions and find some people. I don’t put it I don’t like hiring people because I do have that kind of like narcissistic like I
can do better than most. But the thing is like I haven’t given trust to enough people to execute to learn that for myself. So there there’s
two sides of that coin. But yeah this is funny because it is rare. Like I enjoy this conversation even just
from like like. We definitely should should do this again because it is fascinating that I made a video on this like
entrepreneurship is it about building businesses it’s like
literally about like finding out that you have more control in your life. Yeah like a lot of us grew up with little control and entrepreneurship is one of the first
steps in building more control now that the beauty can come when you learn those
strategies and apply them in other parts your life
like. All right. I know I experience that I can control my income now or like like I can influence it. Now I can have a good influence on my
relationships. I can have a good influence on my
community. Like. Like you can. That’s why you see a lot of entrepreneurs kind of transform into that like. A better versions of themselves they generally Wills a lot of time start. In the one area that they think they can
control which is is that business. And you know I definitely experienced that in my world like. Not knowing that I are not feeling like I could control these other parts of
life so I’ll just focus on the one thing I can’t
control. And yeah that’s something deep work is a good book about this
subject by the way. What am I here. One of my favorite quotes. I’m kind of like rabid on this for my part. But there’s a section in there about the work itself can be a fulfilling part of what you’re
doing. So you know those those columns are good are the four sections but also finding fulfillment in what you’re literally doing is is a result of getting good at it like that’s that was really the big point. So. They they talk about some of these cathedrals in Barcelona. It’s still under construction it’s been a
construction it’s like 600. Right. And the quote in the book is like we have cut stones must always envision cathedrals something to that extent but the point was like. Whatever your. Working on whether it’s copy whatever it is like keeping in mind that bigger picture. Should be part of the process if you’re just doing it for work sake the
clock out you need to really take a harder look at your life. You always sound that’s like just a strong metaphor to all the work in a knowledge world that we’re in like we’re staring at
computers. You know it’s not like a glamorous job a lot of times. So you have to look at it like you said from those four bottoms from the
bigger picture and it can be difficult. It definitely is. But you put in the work sometimes. So Manisha thank you very much for spending the last hour and an hour almost all of us and I’m sure everyone you enjoy you. You love it show your gratitude. A somber assignment and all that to share. So again Sean I appreciate it so much. Yeah everybody he. Absolutely. And if anybody has any questions if this is a replay I’ll try to keep you can tag
me in the comments. I’ll try to keep an eye on this post like
if I’m somebody like clarify this. Feel free to tag me and I’ll jump in and reply. It could be two months down the road. I’ll try to keep jumping in and adding value to this. This is great meant to say thank you very much better guys.

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